Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
- 2pacsgirl
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I had this same problem with Carli Bybel when she uploaded an arabian makeup tutorial. She reduced the hijab to "art" when its true purpose is to cover up religious women. She turned around and said sorry but im not meant to offend anyone its just makeup. Yeah. "Just makeup". Keep your pathetic excuses in future smh
- fihe
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
Don't a lot of makeup "gurus" (I use that term loosely) on YouTube do Arab makeup tutorials? Is it just Carli's hijab-donning that was the issue? I think I've seen that video of hers, and iirc, it was not meant to be an actual hijab, just a head covering.2pacsgirl wrote:I had this same problem with Carli Bybel when she uploaded an arabian makeup tutorial. She reduced the hijab to "art" when its true purpose is to cover up religious women. She turned around and said sorry but im not meant to offend anyone its just makeup. Yeah. "Just makeup". Keep your pathetic excuses in future smh
- 2pacsgirl
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I have an issue with everyone who throws around arabian look and enhances the look with a head covering. You can do arabian makeup without your head coveredfihe wrote:Don't a lot of makeup "gurus" (I use that term loosely) on YouTube do Arab makeup tutorials? Is it just Carli's hijab-donning that was the issue? I think I've seen that video of hers, and iirc, it was not meant to be an actual hijab, just a head covering.2pacsgirl wrote:I had this same problem with Carli Bybel when she uploaded an arabian makeup tutorial. She reduced the hijab to "art" when its true purpose is to cover up religious women. She turned around and said sorry but im not meant to offend anyone its just makeup. Yeah. "Just makeup". Keep your pathetic excuses in future smh
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
- fihe
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
When did Michelle Phan ever make a video of herself trying to look black?TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I was referring to the Instagram picture but my comment was quite general anywayfihe wrote:When did Michelle Phan ever make a video of herself trying to look black?TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
- Trololol
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
Exactly. She never learned from her mistakes, not even when she got called out for her badly done Aaliyah transformation.TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
That was just terrible.
- kittenmuffin
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
2pacsgirl: Oh yeah, Chloe Morello does the same thing as well. She even wear a hijab with tank tops , but at the end of the video I guess she realized that it's inappropriate so she throws cardigan on.
fihe:
reply on the post on Music Festival Looks: Zodiac Sirens thread
Back to the Keegan & Warren's definition, does she behave like the cultures she's trying to represent? It is not even clear whether she's going for Indian or Native American (OMG she didn't think Indian (South Asian) & Indian (Native American) are the same, did she? ). She clearly has no clue about the meaning or story behind the symbols she modified. She said her intention was to "share" and "not offensive". Has she conduct deeper and more thorough research? Not just do research off google and read the first 2-3 results, then off to google images to find "inspirations" (which was a very ignorant and lazy way to do a research)? As an honorary doctorate, shouldn't she understand that? That was freshman bachelor level must-know.
Remember, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, Mish.
fihe:
reply on the post on Music Festival Looks: Zodiac Sirens thread
Of course people are being sensitive about it, it was legacy from their ancestors. It has been one of their identities for hundreds (or even thousands) of years. While Michelle thinks that there is no problem with it, she can't push everybody to think the same way she did. At least not in the ignorant ways she's showing us now. Different people grew up with different backgrounds on different ways, people would have diverse perceptions on their cultures and traditions. She should understand that some cultures are heavily sacred and sensitive, she couldn't just slab on symbols or outfit from different cultures just because it looks cool, push her thoughts to people and bash those who didn't agree."Culture can be defined as ways of living, built up by a group of human beings that are being transmitted from one generation to another. It includes both conscious and unconscious values, ideas, attitudes, and symbols that shape human behavior." (Keegan, Green, 2012)
Back to the Keegan & Warren's definition, does she behave like the cultures she's trying to represent? It is not even clear whether she's going for Indian or Native American (OMG she didn't think Indian (South Asian) & Indian (Native American) are the same, did she? ). She clearly has no clue about the meaning or story behind the symbols she modified. She said her intention was to "share" and "not offensive". Has she conduct deeper and more thorough research? Not just do research off google and read the first 2-3 results, then off to google images to find "inspirations" (which was a very ignorant and lazy way to do a research)? As an honorary doctorate, shouldn't she understand that? That was freshman bachelor level must-know.
Remember, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, Mish.
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I agree and would like to add:Trololol wrote:from: http://jezebel.com/take-that-dot-off-yo ... 1563531208
If you were to wear a bindi to an Indian wedding, or maybe to an Indian festival, that's cool. Removing it from its cultural context especially when you're not FROM that culture is what makes it offensive; you're relying on its exotic allure as aesthetic, and it completely undermines its cultural significance. Essentially, you end up wearing it like it's a fashionable accessory. It's not ok.While I can certainly recognize the celebration of a cultural symbol, this is the exact fine line that separates appreciation and appropriation. The issue that so many people have with the recent bindi summer festival trend is that it doesn't take from Hindu culture on Hindu culture's terms. It takes from Hindu culture on American terms and negates the Hindu aspect through ignorance and exoticism of an "alluring foreign culture." Bindi trend-sporters aren't celebrating a cultural symbol. They're celebrating themselves and the thought-of-it-first appeal of disposable fashion.
I posted this a while back, and it seems no one read it.
My mother used to have me wear a black bindi when I was younger. I'm not Indian, neither is she, but she would have me have it because I was unmarried and to protect me. She used to do the same when she was younger. I loved wearing it - not only because it was beautiful but because I did believe it was protecting me from evil - but I no longer wear it because I was afraid to be seen as offensive.
Now, I believe if someone is wearing a bindi for the reason it should be worn - no matter who they are - then I see no problem with it, usually. But, wearing it as a fashion statement or just "because OMGZ it looks so cool and trendy and I'm so unique lolz", is very rude.
Those are my two cents, but I guess my opinion on who could and should wear a bindi doesn't matter much, for I am not Indian.
edit because I have horrible sentence structure.
- evelin05
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I am slavic but I dont think Michelle will ever be interested in this culture... Not exotic enoughsupaaa wrote:What is everyone's ethnicity and have Michelle offended it yet? Doing a little survey.
- fihe
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
I'm sure Promise would have nailed it.Trololol wrote:Exactly. She never learned from her mistakes, not even when she got called out for her badly done Aaliyah transformation.TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
That was just terrible.
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
Trololol wrote:Exactly. She never learned from her mistakes, not even when she got called out for her badly done Aaliyah transformation.TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
That was just terrible.
Oh God.. she darkened her skin for that tutorial wtf. I don't understand why she didn't think it through.
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
this is....this is blackface...................... darkening your skin colour to match that of a black person is blackface......shes so racist omfg.... why did i never realize..Trololol wrote:Exactly. She never learned from her mistakes, not even when she got called out for her badly done Aaliyah transformation.TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
That was just terrible.
[video][/video]
[video][/video]
these two are appropriating mexican culture...
michelle you ugly racist stop appropriating cultures. learn your own damn culture first you hoe
by the way lmao i commented on the video and she said that i was name calling her when i called her racist lmfao..... the fuck...
off topic but trololol ur so kind - marry me.....
EDIT: I QUOTED SOMEONE WRONG AGAIN SORRY
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
Thats so stupid why would your mom put a bindi on you if its not youre not Hindu. And I wear feathers in my hair for no reason except it looks cool are you going to hate me now? What are the deeper meanings behind feathers? They're just feathers.foxtails9 wrote:I agree and would like to add:Trololol wrote:from: http://jezebel.com/take-that-dot-off-yo ... 1563531208
If you were to wear a bindi to an Indian wedding, or maybe to an Indian festival, that's cool. Removing it from its cultural context especially when you're not FROM that culture is what makes it offensive; you're relying on its exotic allure as aesthetic, and it completely undermines its cultural significance. Essentially, you end up wearing it like it's a fashionable accessory. It's not ok.While I can certainly recognize the celebration of a cultural symbol, this is the exact fine line that separates appreciation and appropriation. The issue that so many people have with the recent bindi summer festival trend is that it doesn't take from Hindu culture on Hindu culture's terms. It takes from Hindu culture on American terms and negates the Hindu aspect through ignorance and exoticism of an "alluring foreign culture." Bindi trend-sporters aren't celebrating a cultural symbol. They're celebrating themselves and the thought-of-it-first appeal of disposable fashion.
I posted this a while back, and it seems no one read it.
My mother used to have me wear a black bindi when I was younger. I'm not Indian, neither is she, but she would have me have it because I was unmarried and to protect me. She used to do the same when she was younger. I loved wearing it - not only because it was beautiful but because I did believe it was protecting me from evil - but I no longer wear it because I was afraid to be seen as offensive.
Now, I believe if someone is wearing a bindi for the reason it should be worn - no matter who they are - then I see no problem with it, usually. But, wearing it as a fashion statement or just "because OMGZ it looks so cool and trendy and I'm so unique lolz", is very rude.
Those are my two cents, but I guess my opinion on who could and should wear a bindi doesn't matter much, for I am not Indian.
edit because I have horrible sentence structure.
What if I just want a rhinestone on my forehead, I can't do that because someone might think it's a bindi? No it's a neon pink rhinestone. My little sister like to put Hello Kitty stickers on her forehead, is she not allowed to do that because it's like a bindi?
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
....man some people dont get racism or culture appropriation a lot. its especially sad when they are from a minority race. but its so insulting when white people tell us to get over it (being offended about racism) or mock us for being offended and hurt.
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
If youre saying Foxtails is stupid then I agree.Calliope wrote:....man some people dont get racism or culture appropriation a lot. its especially sad when they are from a minority race. but its so insulting when white people tell us to get over it (being offended about racism) or mock us for being offended and hurt.
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
im not calling anyone here stupid, just you (supaaa) and another one here insensitive, especially culturally insensitive, and no, im not going to humour you by explaining why you are insensitive.
im actually pretty happy that foxtails have stopped wearing bindi, thanks foxtails!
im actually pretty happy that foxtails have stopped wearing bindi, thanks foxtails!
Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
While this was cringe-worthy I have to say this is more effort than she has put into anything for a very long time.Trololol wrote:Exactly. She never learned from her mistakes, not even when she got called out for her badly done Aaliyah transformation.TrixieMattel wrote:What a stupid girl. She obviously doesn't understand what white supremacy is and what anti-Blackness is. You don't pick up already oppressed and fetishised cultures for artistic/superficial purposes. That's what racism is. You are furthering the gap between what people perceive as the 'norm' and what people perceive as 'the Other'. When you decide to 'look like' a Black person or an Arab etc, you are donning their physical characteristics for a short while with no understanding of the oppression these people face for looking like that. It's atypical of someone who has white supremacy ingrained in them to partake in cultural smudging and then make an apologist remark about how 'we all originated from Africa'. What a dumbo.
That was just terrible.
- Trololol
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
No name calling, people, Jesus, fuck. We're here to discuss what's appropriate when it comes to cultural adaptations.
Foxtail said "Now, I believe if someone is wearing a bindi for the reason it should be worn - no matter who they are - then I see no problem with it, usually. But, wearing it as a fashion statement or just "because OMGZ it looks so cool and trendy and I'm so unique lolz", is very rude." which means she recognizes that it's offensive to just stick one on for blatant exploitation. Her mother probably didn't know better, which is the case with older generations. They didn't have time to think about these things, they were more worried about keeping their kids safe from creeps than they were about who they offended.
And supaaa, wearing feathers are fine. Lots of different cultures have feathers in their traditional outfits. The Dayaks of Borneo have hornbill feathers in their head dresses too, just like how the Maoris of New Zealand wore huia feathers in their head dresses. When it comes to feathers, the type of feathers reflect on the locality, which in turn reflects on the cultural significance. In different cultures, some feathers are sacred, and that should always be respected. In other cultures, feathers are just feathers. The key here is awareness of different cultures and traditions.
Keep your discussion civil. No name calling. What are you trying to achieve? Are you trying to behave like Michelle's minions? Quit acting like a bunch of kindergarteners and pull your heads out of your asses.
Foxtail said "Now, I believe if someone is wearing a bindi for the reason it should be worn - no matter who they are - then I see no problem with it, usually. But, wearing it as a fashion statement or just "because OMGZ it looks so cool and trendy and I'm so unique lolz", is very rude." which means she recognizes that it's offensive to just stick one on for blatant exploitation. Her mother probably didn't know better, which is the case with older generations. They didn't have time to think about these things, they were more worried about keeping their kids safe from creeps than they were about who they offended.
And supaaa, wearing feathers are fine. Lots of different cultures have feathers in their traditional outfits. The Dayaks of Borneo have hornbill feathers in their head dresses too, just like how the Maoris of New Zealand wore huia feathers in their head dresses. When it comes to feathers, the type of feathers reflect on the locality, which in turn reflects on the cultural significance. In different cultures, some feathers are sacred, and that should always be respected. In other cultures, feathers are just feathers. The key here is awareness of different cultures and traditions.
Keep your discussion civil. No name calling. What are you trying to achieve? Are you trying to behave like Michelle's minions? Quit acting like a bunch of kindergarteners and pull your heads out of your asses.
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Re: Michelle & Cultural Appropriation
Obviously she didn't intended to hurt anyone, she was just doing it because it was trendy. So wearing a rhinestone/ fake stud on your forehead makes it a bindi? I think that's silly.